Navigating to "xxx.0" TWA
Post by iconPost by Irish Temper | 2020-04-24 | 17:06:49

Hi All,

Sorry if this has already been covered (search function would be great).

I think I've noticed a trend with some of the big name boats and so maybe it's coincidence...

When I use the dashboard and look at another top boat's TWA, a lot of the time I see: 145.0.

On my boat I'm always between .1 and .4 different. ie. 145.3

When I view the polars, the polar indicates for a given set of conditions that 145.0 TWA is the optimum. I see the good guys TWA set to 145.0. I can't get that to happen on my boat and I usually see something like 145.1 - 145.4.

Is there a way to set my boat's TWA to an exact number? Is this a reason why some boats are just sooo fast all the time because they are more often sailing the optimum angle?

Thanks in advance!

Irish Temper

commenticon 25 Comments
Post by iconPost by zezo | 2020-04-24 | 17:34:33
That's been already discussed somewhere on the forum.

You can do it with the programmer:

- Set a program 10 minutes ahead WITHOUT TWA lock.
- Lock the TWA
- Check resulting TWA in the dashboard
- If not proper, unlock the TWA and move the programmer a minute or few again.
- Repeat to point 2 until satisfied
- Move the programmer 10 minutes from now. TWA stays locked

Same thing works when programming your next tack. Find the spot where the TWS is integer, lock and slide the time to the correct one.

Post by iconPost by Irish Temper | 2020-04-24 | 18:43:00
Awesome! Thank you I'll give it a try. :)

Thanks for all you do!

Post by iconPost by Austen | 2020-08-31 | 06:28:12
Hi David, were you successful with the TWA fine tuning? i keep trying to follow these instructions, but can't quite get it exactly right...I've managed to move a few decimal points but can't get it to stay on my desires angle...
Post by iconPost by YourMomSA | 2020-08-31 | 13:47:12
When the wind is shifting rapidly, moving the unlocked course a minute or two can move the TWA by more than 0.1 degree. So sometimes it's impossible to do it at a particular location. So sometimes you need to push the scheduled maneuver a few hours into the future, to a place where the wind isn't shifting as aggressively, do this process to get the TWA angle you want, and then bring it back to the desired time. Really annoying, particularly if you're in a hurry.
Post by iconPost by BooBill | 2020-08-31 | 14:57:06
Also, check the polars to see if it's even worth the effort. There are peaks and valleys in polars in some places, then it's clearly important to be on a peak. Sometimes it's a smooth interpolation, and wouldn't make any matterial difference. Often it's just important to be on the right side of a particular angle. Going past a max VMG number for instance will usually see a rapid fall off in speed, but being a fraction inside the angle might have an identical VMG.
Post by iconPost by Austen | 2020-09-08 | 05:40:46
thank you Mom and Bill for that assistance. Those comments both make good sense.
Post by iconPost by NumeroDixTV | 2020-12-16 | 13:58:39
Sorry to ask again but i can't do it with consistency. Sometimes it's perfect (like .000) sometimes it doesn't work at all.

Could someone please explain again the exact pattern ?

When you say "unlock/lock twa" you mean the one from the programmer or the one we have right now ?
At the end, do you keep the programmer or do you cancel it ?

Thanks for your help!
Post by iconPost by YourMomSA | 2020-12-16 | 14:14:17
It's a royal pain. Don't expect it to be easy.

Also, when this was written, Dashboard had one decimal of accuracy. Getting to xxx.0 is realistic with some patience. Getting to xxx.000 is lunacy.

You set a programmation for the desired TWA, and confirm. Check dashboard to see what locked. If it isn't what you want, you open the programmation page, go into your scheduled move, unlock it, move it a couple minutes, re-lock it, and confirm. Then check dashboard again to see what you got. Repeat this until you get what you want. Then keep it. Your boat won't sail the desired angle until the xxx.0 programmation actually occurs.

Sometimes, the wind is shifting slowly, so you need to move by more than a couple minutes. Sometimes a lot more. Sometimes it's wavering back and forth, so after shuffling your schedule to get to .1, it goes back to .2, which can be really annoying. Other times, the wind is shifting rapidly, and moving even just one minute goes from .9 to .1. So sometimes, it's easier if you push the programmation point several hours into the future, to a place where the wind is shifting at a steady and moderate pace. Then get what you want. Then bring it back.

But also keep in mind that if often isn't worthwhile. It may be worthwhile when you'll be sailing the same VMG angle for many hours, or when you're sailing an angle that the polars show as a sharp angle where being on the wrong side causes a sudden dropoff in speed. In other cases, it isn't worth it. Also, keep in mind that the gains from this are usually tiny. One other mistake, or one unexpected sailchange, will negate days of trying to get the perfect angle.

Post by iconPost by NumeroDixTV | 2020-12-16 | 14:19:47
Thank you very much, that's more than the answer i expected :)
I gonna try again !

Edit : it works perfectly, thank you so much !
Post by iconPost by whereami | 2020-12-17 | 01:10:42
Does the "spin the compass 360 degrees" trick work for TWA like it does for HDG? (I'd test it, but I'm sailing to a waypoint right now.)
Post by iconPost by YourMomSA | 2020-12-17 | 01:21:28
Post by iconPost by Avontuur | 2021-03-03 | 17:29:58
In the dashboard the TWA is now also .000 when you change it. it looks like the last update has this new feature

Actions: TWA=-132.000 TWA=-125.000 @ 3-3-2021 19:38:00 CET; TWA=-140.000 @ 3-3-2021 20:50:00 CET;
Actions: HDG=139.000 TWA=-125.000 @ 3-3-2021 19:38:00 CET; TWA=-140.000 @ 3-3-2021 20:50:00 CET;
Post by iconPost by YourMomSA | 2021-03-04 | 03:43:04
Yup. It's great in that it takes away the sometimes enormous effort required to gain a tiny advantage while also giving unknowing players without Dashboard an equal chance to hit the same angles as those with Dashboard... But... It will likely also result in far less dispersement of the fleet during the first few hours of each race. We'll see a lot more boats sailing identical angles rather than slightly different angles depending on exactly when they set their TWA. It'll still spread out eventually, though.
Post by iconPost by Inicio | 2021-03-05 | 10:30:50
it's real? Or only a newly limited information from the game?
It's possible to check that?
Post by iconPost by Hardtack | 2021-03-05 | 11:23:16
Yes, it's all in the 'RACE LOG': the 'Command' entries show the commands issued to the server, and the other lines show the boat heading/TWA reported by the server.
Post by iconPost by BooBill | 2021-03-05 | 13:13:57
You've also now lost the ability to sail a fractional TWA should you desire to do that. Trying to finagle a 112.5 twa using the same method we used to get integers just rounds to the nearest whole number.
Post by iconPost by YourMomSA | 2021-03-05 | 17:37:27
That's probably fine. Toxxct's polars will sometimes show optimal TWA's that are fractional, but you'll usually find that the nearest whole number is just as good. The fractional one's benefit is usually in the thousandths of a knot of VMG, if not small enough to be rounded to zero thousandths. And usually, there are tactical reasons why sailing a bit higher or lower than perfect may be better than gaining 0.001 kts anyway.
Post by iconPost by BooBill | 2021-03-05 | 18:49:47
I was thinking more about the case where 122.5 was the line you want, rather than switching back and forth between 120 and 125.

It may sound like nitpicking, but it's going to get harder and harder to separate yourself from the pack through little trim optimizations. Going to have to do it the old-fashioned way and make a divergent weather call.
Post by iconPost by YourMomSA | 2021-03-06 | 04:36:09
Good thing I enjoy divergent weather calls.
Post by iconPost by Inicio | 2021-03-06 | 10:39:15
The last months the TWA was very stable. Now it's not. I doubt about this XX.000.

Post by iconPost by yucatan | 2021-03-06 | 14:36:05
is it possible to get in the same time HDG:xxx.000 and TWA:xxx.000(in your example).
it's very very strange...
before,that never happened.
Post by iconPost by Avontuur | 2021-03-06 | 15:50:59
no that is not the case, I copied the actions, not the actual situation.
it is either TWA .000 or HDG .000
Post by iconPost by Tejo | 2021-03-07 | 17:50:35
In real world wind direction is not steady (it varies in same location in seconds). Why to be so desperate to get an exact TWA? Is it because we are not in the real world? I am a guy that is happy with a 10% position between race competitors, I would like to improve but I really don't see how the exact TWA will help me!
I take this chance to express my most deep admiration to Cvetan and his extraordinary Zezo. Congratulations also to VR Dashboard and to its author.
Post by iconPost by BooBill | 2021-03-07 | 22:06:21
If you look at the polars, there are some really sharp peaks and valleys. For instance for the Maxi Tri at 30knts wind speed, there is a 0.1knt boat speed difference between 150.0 twa and 149.5.

Prior to VR making this change a lot of people would be at 149.5 (which would show as 150 in the interface) and losing 2.4 miles a day to the leaders and wondering why.
Post by iconPost by falcon470 | 2021-03-30 | 09:35:47
In my opinion, deciding your own splitting of the twa according to the polars made the game more beautiful because it required more application and study of the conditions. Surely now we lose much less time but I preferred earlier.
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